microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

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Creesic
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microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Creesic »

I was attempting to get the MRE to read my AEM AFR output when I discovered many of the pins don't work properly.

Pin 32, for whatever reason, wouldn't take in the 5v signal from the gauge, so I looked for other ones.

With ignition turned on, pins 28, 32, 36, and 40 all would go to 3.3v. I'm not an EE, so I'm not exactly sure if that's how they're supposed to function, but nothing would be read when hooking anything up to those pins.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by AndreyB »

Pin 32 is av6. Let's figure out why does it not work for you. Please link your tune. Please confirm you had power cycled ecu after setting change. Please confirm no FATAL indicator
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

https://rusefi.com/online/view.php?msq=845

I always power cycle. I've updated to yesterday's FW. No errors.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by AndreyB »

Please post a photo of the wiring around MRE. Please compare digital multimeter reading with raw voltage gauge if we have raw voltage for that sensor. If we do not we shall add it really quick.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

Not sure what exactly you want to see, but I double checked before making this post with pin 36 floating. Once I turn on ignition, it immediately jumps to a steady 3.3 volts.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

Oh. I forgot to mention I ended up using pin 19. Pin 19 worked fine as an input from my gauge.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by AndreyB »

We are discussing pin 32 right not 36?

Loose wires reading does not mean anything, stuff has to be connected. AT inputs are expected to read voltage but we focus on av6 pin 32 here right?
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

I mean sure, but from other discussion it appeared that all four will behave similarly. Since I'm using pin 19 for my AFR, I should be able to utilize pin 32 for something else right? Can I try using it for my tach? If so, I'll go ahead and hook it up for testing.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

Naw, nevermind, wrong type of pin. I could maybe hook up a power supply to pin 32 to test.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

I'll just splice it. I'll let you know how it behaves in a moment.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

Pin behavior when floating - 3.3v on ignition and only ignition. Not ACC.
Pin behavior when provided voltage from the AFR gauge - Multimeter shows the pin is reading the correct voltage both in ACC and ignition key positions.
When I remove power from the gauge, nothing on ACC, but ignition makes the pin read 1.85v. (Did this just to try)

In Tunerstudio, I have the AFR input to read 0v as 10 and 5v as 19.98 as per the AEM manual.

When on ACC with the gauge functioning, the AFR reads 10.8 in TS and 14.7 on the physical gauge. When I turn on the ignition, the gauge in TS dumps down to 9.67 for 14.7 and when the AEM gauge errors out on the lean end (17+) it sits at 9.73 AFR in Tuner Studio.

Hooking up to pin 19 instead of 32 negates this issue entirely. I will now test this with pin 36.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by Creesic »

Pin 36 exhibits the exact same behavior.
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Re: MRE issues with AN pins

Post by AndreyB »

Creesic wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 4:47 pm
Since I'm using pin 19 for my AFR, I should be able to utilize pin 32 for something else right?
By the way your preference is to talk in connector pins while my preference is to talk in terms of functional designators.

Open question which specific board has what specific resistors R30 R84 R85 R86 populated. Open question is these AV work regardless of corresponding Rxx status.
image.png
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I've made a change to interactive pinout to at least mention aux reuse a bit. https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/commit/9da536c4332cd24c103ccea901811830b45fdf16

Dron and Jared are the experts on this aux reuse part of MRE.
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by mck1117 »

@Cressic, can you take a good photo of the front of your ECU's board?

@Dron_Gus, this looks like we're failing to turn off fault detection on those output channels on the TLE8888. Can you check?
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Creesic »

CF55408C-D423-4298-9A3B-88E18C939FEF.jpeg
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by AndreyB »

This board has all four resistors. If I read the cryptic explanation right it's asking to NOT have 0R resistors for analog to operate
image.png
image.png (34.01 KiB) Viewed 2654 times
let's remove a couple of these resistors and try again on channel where we remove a resistor?
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Dron_Gus »

Short to ground diagnostic is not configurable and always enabled.
Screenshot from 2022-01-25 22-20-26.png
Screenshot from 2022-01-25 22-20-26.png (42.43 KiB) Viewed 2639 times
Pull-down for open load diagnostic is disabled in SW.
If external source for these inputs can be affected by 100..300uA of diagnostic current - then DFB* lines should be cut.
Screenshot from 2022-01-25 22-19-43.png
Screenshot from 2022-01-25 22-19-43.png (18.11 KiB) Viewed 2639 times
Another solution is to put these outputs of TLE8888 to on state as open load current is disabled in on state. This is possible only if external mosfets are not populated. My 0.5.0 MRE come with these mosfets in zip packet.
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Dron_Gus »

Dron_Gus wrote:
Tue Jan 25, 2022 7:26 pm
If external source for these inputs can be affected by 100..300uA of diagnostic current - then DFB* lines should be cut.
20220125_223218.jpg
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Creesic »

Should I cut those traces? Lol
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by AndreyB »

Creesic wrote:
Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:42 am
Should I cut those traces? Lol
please consider removing R84 or R85 per https://rusefi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=44206#p44206
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Creesic »

AndreyB wrote:
Wed Jan 26, 2022 1:54 am

please consider removing R84 or R85 per https://rusefi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=44206#p44206
Which one do I have to remove to make AN6 (pin 32) work?
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by mck1117 »

see schematic above, AV6_MCU is connected to R86
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Creesic »

Well I pulled R86 and it still seemed to behave like it did before. Sat at 3.45v floating.

Trying to use this pin as a launch control switch.
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by AndreyB »

Electricity is magic, floating magic does not mean much.

Many or most switches require a pull-up, is there a pull-up somewhere in this picture?
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Simon@FutureProof »

Would like to confirm this is an issue.

Avi Moore on slack confirmed this was an issue on all 4 Aux reuse pins as it is making low power signals like lambda sensor inputs unusable.(AV6 is default for that :? )

I believe there is already a ticket open for this from some time back when I first spotted it.
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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by MHTSOS »

If we cut the DFB lines like Dron_gus suggested is there any drawback if we don't intend to use the 5090 low side switches?

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Re: microRusEFI issues with AN pins affected by aux reuse

Post by Simon@FutureProof »

I have cut the detection lines to the TLE8888 before with no downsides but did not want to do that unless someone was having issues.
There are some traces just to the right of the additional drivers that do the detection, it all still works with the detection lines cut.

IMO if it is impossible to disable this then it is a reason to move away from the TLE entirely for any revisions of the MRE.
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