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Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:12 am
by Creesic
Running it by Andrey, seems as though the BMW Hellen 88 board will support an ETB. I'm doing this to delete the clunky factory IAC to make some room, and I could maybe use a few more features with an ETB anyway.
Would anyone happen to know how I can wire it in? And would anyone have any recommendations of one? Maybe 3" inlet?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:16 am
by AndreyB
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:18 am
by Creesic
Just wondering if I can assign the pins myself in tunerstudio or something. Need to do a little more research on what wires are necessary on those in order for them to function.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:20 am
by nmstec
e36? I had done the same thing with removing the IAC and PCV, and plasma cut myself an ETB adapter to fit a vw rabbit ETB on an M50 intake. I can get you a parts list of it, but mines a big ridiculous since im turbo charging it.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:23 am
by Creesic
nmstec wrote: ↑Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:20 am
e36? I had done the same thing with removing the IAC and PCV, and plasma cut myself an ETB adapter to fit a vw rabbit ETB on an M50 intake. I can get you a parts list of it, but mines a big ridiculous since im turbo charging it.
E34 TU with an NV in it. Used the TU harness. What engine was it from? Might be a simple solution, or I could just run a generic GM part.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 3:27 am
by stefanst
Would an M54 intake manifold with ETB fit?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 3:51 am
by stefanst
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jan 01, 2022 7:39 pm
by Creesic
Thanks for this, but no, because I'm using
https://www.ebay.com/itm/401736590801 as a manifold. Have to adapt something up to that. Might as well go larger.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:26 am
by stefanst
That's an interesting looking manifold. Do you by any chance have a dyno comparison to the stock OBD1 intake?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sun Jan 02, 2022 1:34 am
by AndreyB
Creesic wrote: ↑Sat Jan 01, 2022 12:12 am
Would anyone happen to know how I can wire it in?
Molex 0039301020 would be the part to solder to PCB. Open question what would you need to make the harness side - that's for DC motor on the ETB. Somewhere there must be pins for pedal and TPS many answers would be in PCB schematics I assume
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Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Thu Feb 03, 2022 1:39 am
by Creesic
The more I look at the pinout, the more it looks like I'm just going to have to go Proteus. It doesn't look like this will just accept an electric pedal and ETB without a completely new PCB.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:25 am
by Creesic
Doesn't look like there's a Proteus in stock, so I guess we're back to modifying the Hellen. I do have that connector, though it's not labled at all for an ETB or PPS.
Would modification to the board to accept those things be simple enough to do?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:27 am
by AndreyB
Creesic wrote: ↑Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:25 am
Doesn't look like there's a Proteus in stock
I am looking at a stack of Proteus ECUs in stock. It looks like you've made some assumption based on something?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:31 am
by AndreyB
Creesic wrote: ↑Fri Feb 04, 2022 5:25 am
I do have that connector, though it's not labled at all for an ETB or PPS.
Would modification to the board to accept those things be simple enough to do?
I would love to help but I've lost the contest.
Let's begin from the beginning. Let's pick a simple and specific project and approach this one project at a time.
Do you have electronic pedal in your possession? Do you have all information you need to wire in two channels of throttle pedal?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:42 pm
by Creesic
There just went any for sale on eBay. Assumed you were waiting on more to come in.
Context is I'm trying to make an ETB work on my Hellen 88 for my E34.
I do have a PPS I can use and an ETB. I have no clue how to wire it into the Hellen 88 and that's what this post is about. It's not labled anywhere to be used that way.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 3:44 pm
by AndreyB
I need your help in pin pointing where does your understanding of this board end at the moment
Q1: are you aware of
https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/wiki/Hellen-88-BMW
Q2: does above link to
https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/wiki/Hardware/Hellen/hellen88bmw-a-schematic.pdf
Q3: did you have a chance to find J20 and J21 on the schematics
Q4: did you have a chance to locate J20 and J21 on the actual PCB.
Q5: did you have a chance to locate silkscreen of J20 and J21 on the back side of the PCB
Q6: are you currently blocked in terms of deciding how to physically connect to J20 and J21
Please give me a one-five word response for each of these six questions just for me to better understand where are you blocked on the overall journey exactly.
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Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Feb 04, 2022 3:46 pm
by AndreyB
Creesic wrote: ↑Fri Feb 04, 2022 1:42 pm
There just went any for sale on eBay. Assumed you were waiting on more to come in.
Gotcha. Just clarified that on
https://rusefi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=44274#p44274
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2022 7:09 pm
by Creesic
AndreyB wrote: ↑Fri Feb 04, 2022 3:44 pm
I need your help in pin pointing where does your understanding of this board end at the moment
Q1: are you aware of
https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/wiki/Hellen-88-BMW
Q2: does above link to
https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/wiki/Hardware/Hellen/hellen88bmw-a-schematic.pdf
Q3: did you have a chance to find J20 and J21 on the schematics
Q4: did you have a chance to locate J20 and J21 on the actual PCB.
Q5: did you have a chance to locate silkscreen of J20 and J21 on the back side of the PCB
Q6: are you currently blocked in terms of deciding how to physically connect to J20 and J21
Please give me a one-five word response for each of these six questions just for me to better understand where are you blocked on the overall journey exactly.
image.png
Yes, and no to the rest. Now that I'm going ahead with it, I'll try to learn how to use the schematics. I'll report back here if I come across another issue. Thank you.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2022 7:13 pm
by Creesic
Actually, now that I'm looking at it, where are the + and - connections for the ETB motor?
Still learning to navigate this stuff.
I'm gonna try to cross reference labels from the MRE, maybe I can find it that way.
-Edit: "E-THROTTLE+" or "E-THROTTLE-" do not appear in the Hellen88 schematic like they do in the MRE schematic.
Gonna try to find another solution.
I've located J20 and J21 physically. I understand what goes where here, however I'm still lost on where the E-THROTTLE+ and - are supposed to connect.
Found it? E14 and E15? +ETB and -ETB?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2022 7:28 pm
by AndreyB
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Thu Feb 17, 2022 7:34 pm
by Creesic
Gotcha. J19 is the DC motor + and -
J20 and J21 are for the TPS and PPS. Thanks Andrey!
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2022 3:47 am
by Creesic
Proposed this addition to
https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/blob/master/firmware/config/boards/hellen/hellen88bmw/connectors/main.yaml
so that I can actually assign the inputs I need for the external TPS and PPS.
- pin: Aux PPS2
# H144_IN_AUX2
id: EFI_ADC_14
class: analog_inputs
ts_name: Aux PPS2
- pin: Aux TPS2
# H144_IN_AUX1
id: EFI_ADC_8
class: analog_inputs
ts_name: Aux TPS2
- pin: Aux TPS3
# H144_IN_AUX3
id: EFI_ADC_15
class: analog_inputs
ts_name: Aux TPS3
Now what I need to figure out is how to add PWM2 and PWM3 (ETB + and ETB - respectively (C6,C7)) unless that's already just gonna be set?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2022 4:08 am
by AndreyB
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2022 10:01 pm
by Creesic
Need one more because PPS1 isn't selectable.
I think it's pin 37 on the STM32, so...
- pin: PPS1
# H144_IN_PPS
id: EFI_ADC123_IN3
class: analog_inputs
ts_name: PPS1
But I'm unsure if "EFI_ADC123_IN3" is correct.
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2022 10:08 pm
by AndreyB
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Jul 09, 2022 1:48 pm
by AndreyB
Any luck with all the updates?
Any pics of your overall setup - is it still on the bench or already on the vehicle?
Re: Hellen88 ETB support
Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2022 6:58 pm
by Creesic
I'm still figuring everything out, and just got it to fire on all 6 cylinders. I'll document everything after it's all worked out.
Apparently you have to set ignition settings to wasted spark with "Individually wired wasted spark" set to true. I had it set to individual coils, and it only fired on cylinders 1,3, and 5.