Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

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Ecorli57
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Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Hi I have a Bmw 850ci M73 1996 euro specs supercharged but after the supercharger installation it turns on a big nightmare because ,bmy ecus are almost imposible to tune because those are Motronic 5.2 That has OTP EPROMs no reflash eproms so my car has been on different shops the last 5 years because here in the states no body could comunícate with the ecus because does not have a obd2 connector just an round connector on the engine bay so I hope you could help me or find some solution because the oem ecus and eml and tcu are so married with the car, so maybe you could get som e solution with your rusefi protus m73 stand alone
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by AndreyB »

Where in the states are you?

We have zero interest to handle weird stepper motors and weird pedal - we prefer simpler modern ETBs and simpler modern pedals see https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/wiki/HOWTO-M73-v12-on-Proteus

Your 96 harness is probably not using https://www.ebay.com/itm/333779143374 like my 1998 but maybe https://www.ebay.com/itm/333833818007 so someone would have to solder wires to those https://www.ebay.com/itm/333833818007

Biggest unknown is what kind of CAN messages is that gearbox expecting. We can make rusEFI send any CAN message as long as we know which ones are needed, which we currently do not know. Maybe someone on the internet would be available to help, maybe gearbox would be happy without CAN messages.
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by AndreyB »

Also question who exactly would do what work :) Would it be @abricos soldering custom harness at $90 an hour? Would it be you?
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bill
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

you can fix the Transmission problem by going with a Manual 6 Speed Getrag 420
That is what i did on my V12

and increase the value of your car by $20,000

you can run the rest of the car / CAN by just Spoofing the engine / ECU CAN outputs...
Then the rest of the chassis can do its operations thinking the ECU is working fine ...

https://rusefi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1749&sid=f2d185a5932a1e63fd6ea7c37d7771fe&start=120
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

I am in texa
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Texas
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Yes I thing my ecus has this connector https://www.ebay.com/itm/333833818007
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

. So do you recommend the Nissan Hitachi SERA576-01 60mm throttle body recommended. instead th oem throttle bodies ? Those
The Nissan throttle bodies have to machined to fit on the m73 intake manifolds ?
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Any tutorial or advice how to do this, you can run the rest of the car / CAN by just Spoofing the engine / ECU CAN outputs...
Then the rest of the chassis can do its operations thinking the ECU is working fine ,
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by AndreyB »

Ecorli57 wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:34 am
Any tutorial or advice how to do this, you can run the rest of the car / CAN by just Spoofing the engine / ECU CAN outputs...
Then the rest of the chassis can do its operations thinking the ECU is working fine ,
You need a professional :( You need someone who would be able to assemble everything and get everything running for you. If you have enough $$$ worst case you would have to ship this car to NJ.
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

Ecorli57 wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 12:26 am
. So do you recommend the Nissan Hitachi SERA576-01 60mm throttle body recommended. instead th oem throttle bodies ? Those
The Nissan throttle bodies have to machined to fit on the m73 intake manifolds ?
the nissan v6 throttle bodies just need to have their mounting holes enlarged... to fit the bmw intake manifold.
takes 10 minutes ...
then you can run a modern ECU
everything else is pretty standard -- the OEM BMW stuff works fine
the crank sensor, the cam sensor, the temp sensor, the fuel injectors , etc all that stuff works fine
i use the GM "yukon" coils, they work fine , so you can ditch the distributors and crap

the OEM Engine has THREE siemens ecu boxes attached to it
not sure what they do, but there are lots of them

you might want to keep the original parts in your garage-- not throw them out, and not hack the loom up too much, since people want "original " when buying cars...

andrey did make a harness for the Proteus ECU, and it plugs into the stock wiring connectors, so you don't have to butcher the wiring loom
Last edited by bill on Tue Mar 02, 2021 2:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Can bus
Can bus
FFDF4A68-961D-47FD-819C-1AB10FF21702.png (377.2 KiB) Viewed 13970 times
I don know if this photo data link can bus could help
Can bus
Can bus
FFDF4A68-961D-47FD-819C-1AB10FF21702.png (377.2 KiB) Viewed 13970 times
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AndreyB
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by AndreyB »

bill wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 2:01 am
andrey did make a harness for the Proteus ECU, and it plugs into the stock wiring connectors, so you don't have to butcher the wiring loom
mine is M73N but here we have non-N M73
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

is that everything on your CAN BUS?? just 5 boxes? and 4 of them are crap can be taken off?

so the only thing you want to save is the "slip" box on the CAN bus?
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

this unit will get you close-- may have to modify some connectors, but you get the idea... It is doable ...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/rusEFI-Proteus-BMW-M73-v12-standalone-ECU-with-PnP-harness/333805057834?hash=item4db854f72a:g:IIYAAOSwE~9f9eSd
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

do you have pictures of your engine/ supercharger setup?
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

mck1117
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by mck1117 »

bill wrote:
Tue Mar 02, 2021 2:19 am
also, here is a manual tranny for your V12 https://www.copart.com/lot/59305320/salvage-1995-bmw-540-i-nc-raleigh
that is not turn-key - welding modification of the bellhousing required
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Here are some photos of the supercharger
4F9E97F7-CB32-4997-BA13-B026D6E11C6D.png
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4A09F7F2-F017-40C3-AF73-BE51B2036481.png
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3A279100-36BB-4556-86A1-5FC44E5BDEC0.png
3A279100-36BB-4556-86A1-5FC44E5BDEC0.png (4.26 MiB) Viewed 13952 times
bill
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

are you running the supercharger currently? i see there is no belt on it in the photos ...
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

also, where are the OEM MAF sensors? did you move them to a new spot? there are 2 MAF, correct?
i added a bosch Temp MAP sensor to the intake manifold and got rid of the OEM MAF sensors
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Yes has two maf sensors just habe been relocated see photo attached

so the car just ran about 300 miles with the supercharger It took about a month for the ecus to learn the new forced induction and bigger injectors parameters but after a month the car start to run well ,the engine really awake it broke the tires since low rpms, he problem was that the guy that sold me the kit when he came to install it left a supercharger oil cooler hose lose ,so when I picked up the car from the shop on the first drive , when I have arrived to my home I noticed that It had a big oil leakage so I noticed that the oil cooler hose from the supercharge had pop out so ,I call the guy to let him know and I re plug the hose and add supercharger oil but after a month when I was on the freeway at high rpm running with a mustang suddenly I felt that the car lost power so the belt from the supercharge was broken and then started the nightmare because back then in 2013 I did not work on my cars my self like now so 3 shops and thousands of dollars wasted no one could restart the car again once one of them reinstall the S/c belt until the last one took off the engine and noticed that the supercharger was stoked so that was there reason that the car did not start but the guy went to jail so now I an struggling with his wife that now is in charge of the shop so they started to work in my car but they still not be able to get communication with the ecus so that is the reason that I want to see if is there an other ecu options
Attachments
62CD968B-F552-42BD-BA22-5FB044EB8954.jpeg
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Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

About map sensor I would like to do that but with the oem ecus that have my car .it is imposible because it is no way to tune them those are M5.2 I,but the 1997 ecus M5.2.1 I know that is possible tu tune it but those are no compatible or nobody knows how to marry with my car
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

You need a professional :( You need someone who would be able to assemble everything and get everything running for you. If you have enough $$$ worst case you would have to ship this car to NJ.

Oops yes I know ,so are you in NJ?
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

two of the guys is in NJ
everybody else is all over the world
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by bill »

we were all having a chat about your car, and here are some comments ..
just For Your Info

If supercharger lost oil it's 99% Dead supercharger ... If he don't have intercooler ... Impeller and supercharger oil flew inside the engine ..

Minimum it needs the manifolds off, a boroscope to check for FOD damage, the charger checked out and a bloody good clean up

I've seen compressor wheels come apart and end up coming out the tailpipe in a thousand pieces
I've seen compressor wheels stuck in cylinder heads

The whole setup was a ticking bomb. He boosted the engine and relied on the stock ECU long term fuel trim to compensate for the extra needed fuel. I think most ECUs limit the correction to +/- 25 or 30%. Even if that was enough to not have it running lean he was using NA afr and NA ignition timing to run boost on a stock engine with NA CR. I don't think it's just the supercharger that died.

you might want to check out this other stuff, to make sure there is no damage to the V12, before you put a new ECU on the engine...
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

bill wrote:
Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:13 pm
we were all having a chat about your car, and here are some comments ..
just For Your Info

If supercharger lost oil it's 99% Dead supercharger ... If he don't have intercooler ... Impeller and supercharger oil flew inside the engine ..

Minimum it needs the manifolds off, a boroscope to check for FOD damage, the charger checked out and a bloody good clean up

I've seen compressor wheels come apart and end up coming out the tailpipe in a thousand pieces
I've seen compressor wheels stuck in cylinder heads

The whole setup was a ticking bomb. He boosted the engine and relied on the stock ECU long term fuel trim to compensate for the extra needed fuel. I think most ECUs limit the correction to +/- 25 or 30%. Even if that was enough to not have it running lean he was using NA afr and NA ignition timing to run boost on a stock engine with NA CR. I don't think it's just the supercharger that died.

you might want to check out this other stuff, to make sure there is no damage to the V12, before you put a new ECU on the engine...
Yes the car has an intercooler Ok I bought a new supercharger the car was running after the the belt was broken, once the technician install the belt the car did not start any more i mean he install the belt on the old supercharger they do not know that the supercharger was almost stocked sot two different shops where trying to start the car for a wile several months ,I hope that now with the new supercharger the car start again now I will install two inovate AFR gauges to see how it is the AFR even I had installed a begi 2530 Multi role fuel,pressure regulator to help to increase the fuel , but back then I do not have the AFR gauges yet , I thinking to install a split second and enricher and split second PSC1-013P Programmable Signal Calibrato that it is a dual Chanel even a eflexfuel kit just I am waiting that the technician start the car again so let me know what do you think about that so thanks for the advice I will recommend to the technician to check the intake manifold ,so the technician sent the supercharger to rebuild but he said that does not work well and I bought a new one so the technician gaibe me the old supercharger dissembled and I contact to the rebuilder and he said that I have to resend him the supercharger so I did it , once he have received he said that some thing bad happened with the technician because the supercharger was disassembled and has and used parts so I do not Know waht think it about that so he rebuild again the old supercharger and i teste on my son m3 and is working well now so for that reason I am pretty sure that did not sent any piece I to the engine but who knows I will check it to be sure
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Abricos »

what is the geographic location of the car ???
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

Abricos wrote:
Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:42 am
what is the geographic location of the car ???
Houston Texas
Ecorli57
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Re: Bmw 850 ci M73 supercharged

Post by Ecorli57 »

AndreyB wrote:
Mon Mar 01, 2021 7:18 pm
Where in the states are you?

We have zero interest to handle weird stepper motors and weird pedal - we prefer simpler modern ETBs and simpler modern pedals see https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/wiki/HOWTO-M73-v12-on-Proteus

Your 96 harness is probably not using https://www.ebay.com/itm/333779143374 like my 1998 but maybe https://www.ebay.com/itm/333833818007 so someone would have to solder wires to those https://www.ebay.com/itm/333833818007

Biggest unknown is what kind of CAN messages is that gearbox expecting. We can make rusEFI send any CAN message as long as we know which ones are needed, which we currently do not know. Maybe someone on the internet would be available to help, maybe gearbox would be happy without CAN messages.
Is it posible to set a proteus on a 88 pin conectors and transfer the oem software from the oem ecus to the proteus?I have read the files from my first oem ecus when some guy in Australia was Imstalled Evc boards with 32 pin eproms but one of the ecus that he modified Did not work, just lost my money, i mean i. That way the proteus could get comunication with the whall car?
Last edited by Ecorli57 on Sun Mar 07, 2021 2:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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