[rusEfi] 1990 Geo Storm GSI - Advice/Suggestions? #18

[Spine]

I can build my own ignition module if the rusEfi can proved ground to coil when it wants spark. When I get home tomorrow morning, I'll draw up some quick schematics for you to review.

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[AndreyB]

@ would be the one to review schematics. You have x12 "low to something" chips - http://rusefi.com/wiki/index.php?title=Manual:Hardware_Frankenso_board#Low_side

[Spine]

They are very basic. Just need an automotive condenser (or ceramic / film) capacitor. Got specs for capacitor written down in my book of "stuff".

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[kb1gtt]

I would need to look at the igniter. The primary side of the coil will have a 400V-ish spike and the injector drivers will clamp to much lower voltages which would typically prevent spark when under compression. This means they can not directly drive the coils with the injector drivers. However if you have an igniter that happens to have a 12V pull up, and it only needs to be pulled down to 0V, the low sides could work for that. However it's more traditional to use the hi/low for driving an external igniter.

[Spine]

Like I said in the original post - I'm an old-school mechanic, so I'll give you an old-school solution. Perhaps you can modify for an additional add-on board or even integrate it into the current board. Here's the schematic. (Of course the output of the coil goes to a spark plug that's also grounded or even the distributor cap - forgot to put that in the schematic).

2post_coil_circuit-1960_build.png (19.67 KiB) Viewed 18005 times

[kb1gtt]

I suspect your note about 100V is not quite high enough, but might be for older school lawn motors and small engines and such with low compression ratios and small gaped plugs. I expect the voltage at the points to get up to 400V-ish, especially if driven with an electronic circuit. The arcing of points would tend to help keep the voltage down, which is something you don't get with electronic drive.

The J701 is reasonably low cost, and lower cost if found form a salvage yard. It's also reasonably easy to wire.

[AndreyB]

The J701 is reasonably low cost, and lower cost if found form a salvage yard. It's also reasonably easy to wire.

J701 is very cheap on eBay but I am unable to find a good query to find it bundled with a plug. Without a plug J701 would be pretty much useless, would not it?

[Spine]

Nifty, well - digging through my old racing stuff, I found my electronic ignition module that matches my coil. It's very basic and simple. The green wire going to the distributor is the trigger to "spark" the coil. I'll need to re-gap the plugs to compensate.

I'll be wiring this in soon. +MAG and -MAG will be tapped off per the instructions.

race_ignition_module.jpg (2.91 MiB) Viewed 17988 times

[kb1gtt]

Seems "IGNITION COIL CONNECTOR" is a good search term, but seems to need you to search for a specific vehicle. I found an e-bay listing that seemed to indicate a MAZDA B2600 uses a J701, I then used the model and found the below harness. It appears to be at least close, as it has 3 wires and flat connectors.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Set-of-4-Connector-Plug-Harness-For-Nissan-Skyline-Ignition-Coil-sr20-rb20-rb25-/262341584122?hash=item3d14c6e4fa:g:KccAAOSwKrhVWg4f&vxp=mtr

Of course salvage yard can find stuff for the low $.

Do you have a schematic for that coil driver? I don't know what is inside that brick.

[Spine]

I'm not sure what's in the brick. I've always hooked it up to my vehicle from the pickup coil through the distributor via the green distributor wire.

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[Spine]

Ok, so the "brick" is installed. For rusEfi to be able to use it, when it needs spark it needs to ground the green wire (distributor). I have that connected to Ignition Module 1 (PE14) or #11 on Block 2.

[AndreyB]

In TunerStudio you should be able to assign PE14 to ignition #1. Without a jumper it should be GND. In both TS and console there are buttons to bench test this output - in console it's one of the last tabs.

Do you want to edit your first post on this topic and have something like
ALL rusEfi PIN SETTINGS:
section?

[Spine]

Getting much closer:

triggers_001.png (148.18 KiB) Viewed 17981 times

Do you want to edit your first post on this topic and have something like
ALL rusEfi PIN SETTINGS:
section?

Where would I do that?

[AndreyB]

Can you edit using http://rusefi.com/forum/posting.php?mode=edit&f=3&p=16443 link? All the way down.

We still need to change your trigger once we are closer - you see how coil widths are not the same, it's because yours is not "1+1" but something else. How many teeth per cam revolution?

[Spine]

There are 4 teeth total on the distributor. The distributor is directly connected to the cam so it's a 1 to 1 ratio. I would assume it gets 4 triggers to one revolution (as there are 4 teeth).

[Spine]

Can you edit using http://rusefi.com/forum/posting.php?mode=edit&f=3&p=16443 link? All the way down.?

Not sure if it's the subject you want me to change or the topic attribute, or if it's something that isn't showing up. This is what I have when I click the link provided:

Options.png (116.67 KiB) Viewed 17971 times

[AndreyB]

I wanted you to put all the non-standard pins like your non-default fuel pump.

Is there a way to cut one of these four teeth? This case you would know which cylinder is which.

[Spine]

Gotcha, when I'm back at the house and have a minute I'll update the first post with what I have. Basically what's in the breakout box, but also labeled low and hi right?

I'd rather not cut off one of the teeth, but I will if necessary. It's hard to find a distributor for this vehicle. Local junk yards don't have them here. They have my other one, but not this one.

[AndreyB]

No rush to cut, we can totally run this without cutting.

[Spine]

Quick question -

Can you double check the hardware/software? When I change the fuel pump relay to pin PE10 for hi and IGN4 to PE4, I lose triggers for CAM timing, and then the USB=>COM connection becomes unstable. When I change it back to the original it's stable again and I have CAM triggers functioning.

If we need specific logs for that, let me know and I'll attempt to get them how you need them. Or perhaps I'm doing something wrong...?

[AndreyB]

What are your console & firmware versions? (both are in console window title). I've made some fixed around fatal error handling on Monday and this sounds like another pin mapping conflict to me. Can you download fresh http://rusefi.com/build_server/rusefi_bundle.zip and "Program Debug"?

The fixes on Monday were to make a move visible FATAL message on the console and to make sure that the red LED on the green board stays on in case of a fatal error. Once you upgrade, please tell me if you have the red LED between the buttons on or off?

[Spine]

Sounds good, I'll take that on sometime today - again if the crap stops hitting the fan at work.

So, download the new bundle, wipe firmware, flash firmware with new from downloaded bundle (use debug). Then test by changing pins as required.

[AndreyB]

yep. Wipe not required, by not wiping you keep your configuration changes.

[Spine]

I attempted to reflash with the new bundle - but when it was finished the ECM would not come back online. I also tried erase, then program/debug but still no one's home. Please double check the bin file?

[AndreyB]

You were actually right - there was a bug which were debug version would not start on a freshly-erased chip. I was failing to reproduce it because I was not erasing the chip before flashing!

Now fixed, both debug and release would start on a freshly erased chip.

[Spine]

Awesome will try when I get back to town. Is there a new download link?

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[AndreyB]

Same http://rusefi.com/build_server/rusefi_bundle.zip

[Spine]

Program/Debug works... Still has communication issues after changing settings but manageable.

I have made a "custom" trigger setting. Perhaps someone could take a look and help me fine-tune it?
Here is the log:

MAIN_rfi_report_2016-04-18 14_39.csv

(359 KiB) Downloaded 399 times

Using TunerStudio MS, here are my trigger settings:

triggers_002.png (47.45 KiB) Viewed 17866 times

[AndreyB]

What RPM are you are getting while cranking? The log looks as expected at this phase.

By the way, thank you for your patience. To be honest, you are (hopefully) going to be the first engine started without talking to me on the phone, so I am filling the gaps in the documentation as you are asking questions.

Assuming you have the hardware ready to spark we now need to find your TDC position - we know trigger shape but we do not know the trigger wheel position in relation to TDC.

See http://rusefi.com/wiki/index.php?title=Manual:First_engine_start#Confirm_TDC_position
See http://rusefi.com/wiki/index.php?title=Manual:First_engine_start

[Spine]

It's is approximately 300-375rpms when cranking. I'll look into the timing and TDC soon.

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