[info] Ignition modules

Hardware inside and outside of the ECU
Rhinoman
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by Rhinoman »

It looks like they separate the ignition signals from the others on the connector, I assume they also keep the wiring separate; that wouldn't be easy to do with the Mazda connector. Its easy for Bosch to do they have a lot of R&D money and can make most stuff in house to keep costs down.
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kb1gtt
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by kb1gtt »

Also on the list of internal igniters is my V8 96 Dodge RAM. I made no OEM harness changes. I added the ignition module to the Frankenso board, even used a little duct tape for insulation :) Some point I need to start spinning those IO re-mapping boards. The things I scabbed in there are not pretty.
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AndreyB
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Re: Ignition modules

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because we know https://www.oshpark.com/shared_projects/OChRKHDe works do we need a x4 version for the v8 people?
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marko
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by marko »

Has anyone tried ST ignition driver IC VB325SP (or others, 025, 525, maybe more, some obsolete)

http://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/technical/document/datasheet/group2/17/de/78/a8/5c/62/42/eb/CD00003432/files/CD00003432.pdf/jcr:content/translations/en.CD00003432.pdf

logic input, has diagnostic. Seems like... it was designed for this..?
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AndreyB
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Re: Ignition modules

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Welcome! Have not tried but thank you for the link!
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kb1gtt
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by kb1gtt »

Pleasure to meet you.

Do you have an application that needs ignition control? Should this be made into some kind of break out board?
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marko
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by marko »

Not specifically no. I've been researching a bit, taking apart some Bosch ECUs, etc.

Years ago I planned to megasquirt my old (now really old) Audi 200 with 10V 5cyl turbo. (it has K-jetronic mechanical injection, and hitachi distributor based electronic ignition. Hitachi ECU also controls things like fuel pump, knock, boost, can slightly influence the fuel mixture, etc).

Anyway I got looking back into it somewhat recently and megasquirt has really really crazy license (yet they somehow got the "open source" hype, which it is definitely not). Also I feel the hardware is very amateur night. So my dream is something like motronic, but instead of C167, STM32 which I am familiar with and has open tools. Use similar peripheral ICs for controlling things, things from ST or infineon (and some motorola, too) seem to be the best documented. They seem to be wide temperature range, load dump rated, built in diagnostics, etc... built for the purpose really. I think the sourcing of some bosch ones may be difficult sometimes too, so probably better to design around ones from others. Ie. today they are all on aliexpress but will that stick around?


I'm fairly confident Bosch actually gets ST to make their ICs too. The Bosch ICs are nice but documentation is lacking on many of them. ( I don't think anyone other than ST and Bosch ICs have that ugly font).




Anyway back to this topic, I'll have 5 coils for my 5 cylinders. Not sure if ill use 'dumb' coilpacks with driver in the ECU, or an amplifier in the engine bay (something like I linked) -- or use VW coilpacks (driver is integral) and use something like bosch CK110 or CK200 to drive those. (which is how 2000 ... 2010? era motronic does it).

CK110: http://www.bosch-semiconductors.de/media/automotive_electronics/product_information/CK110_Product_Info.pdf

CK110 isn't strictly necessary for VW (internal driver) coilpacks but having disgnostics is nice.

anyway kinda rambling, thanks for the welcome!
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kb1gtt
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by kb1gtt »

Purpose built chips have both pro's and con's. Component obsolescence is a real problem. Using more generic chips often have less obsolescence issues and typically work good enough. However purpose built chips are often smaller and commonly decrease the costs. Any how, some things to keep in mind.
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Rhinoman
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by Rhinoman »

marko wrote:I'm fairly confident Bosch actually gets ST to make their ICs too.

Bosch have their own fab.

I've used Ignition IGBTs with cheap comparator circuits to monitor current on a couple ECUs but mostly the igniters have been built into the coils. The integrated drivers will work OK, the semiconductor manufacturers only ever make ICs if there is a demand for them so they will be used in a high volume OEM ECU somewhere.
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by marko »

Rhinoman wrote:
marko wrote:I'm fairly confident Bosch actually gets ST to make their ICs too.

Bosch have their own fab.
Ahh, good to know. Shame they aren't a bit more open with the datasheets. It would be nice if the actual PN was on the IC, too :cry:
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AndreyB
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Re: Ignition modules

Post by AndreyB »

An improvement for https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/tree/master/hardware/DDPAK_breakout would be to make signal wire hole just a bit bigger.

Bottom-left hole on this picture

Code: Select all

1) RESOLVED IN R0.2 DPAK2 is apparently different than D2PAK, now it uses TO-263AB
2) RESOLVED IN R0.2 Make vias under large GND pad larger to allow more heat form iron during soldering
3) RESOLVED IN R0.2 move Via's to PCB edge to allow install on proto area of Frankenso
4) RESOLVED IN R0.2 add 4-40 mounting screw hole(s)
5)                  signal wire hole to be a bit bigger - bottom-left on https://raw.githubusercontent.com/rusefi/rusefi/master/hardware/DDPAK_breakout/BTS2140.jpg
Image
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AndreyB
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Re: Ignition modules

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