let's choose an enclosure

Hardware inside and outside of the ECU
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mobyfab
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by mobyfab »

I think it's definitely worth a try.

You can also solder the headers directly on the boards. (from the side of the board, one row on each side, but you need 1.2mm thick PCBs)

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by stefanst »

kb1gtt wrote:Y[...]The key issue I see with this is the assembly labor. That will likely be more costly than what ever jumper device is chosen.[...]
At this point, rusefi is still very much a DIY device and cost for low-skill labor, aka the kind of work most of us can do, should not enter into the equation. It's a hobby and the definition of a hobby is "Achieve minimum effect with maximum effort". While how much money I'm spending on my hobby is important (i.E,. money not spent on ECUs can be spent on other fun car parts), the amount of time spent is less critical.

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

I understand that @russian commonly does this soldering. Which consumes time. I'm trying to avoid his time. He's doing it because it takes less time to solder than to answer questions about how to connect things in the forum.
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by Dron_Gus »

Dron_Gus wrote:Mating parts are available at Mouser. Just need to dig some documentation about exact part numbers. http://www.te.com/commerce/DocumentDelivery/DDEController?Action=showdoc&DocId=Specification+Or+Standard%7F108-5280%7FF6%7Fpdf%7FJapanese%7FJPN_SS_108-5280_F6.pdf%7F3-178780-6
Looks like mate parts are
26 pins (10 hi-current + 16 low-current) 174516-6
16 pins (all low current) 174514-6
12 pins (all low current) 174913-1
22 pins (6 hi-current + 16 low-current) 174515-6
And terminals 173716-1 or 173716-2 and 173630-1 or 173630-2
All of them are available at Mouser (not sure if it is easy to order to Russia, but I'll try)
So only one problem is PCB connector - 178780-6 - currently available only on eBay from one seller.
All connectors have arrived. (yellow is stock ECU connector)
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Only low-current terminals (173716) look wrong. Need to get crimper to test.

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AndreyB
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

Toyota 89661-32590 offers this double-pcb idea if we need more space on the board. I wonder if we can find these ribbon cables with 25 pin with exposed stripped wires on both ends, or of there is some fancy tool to strip ribbon cables?
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

At the moment Denso case Frankenso is using is about $20 - including a used connector (new connectors also available) - and used pigtails are under $20, but those are getting harder to get. I am starting to think about a new case and a new approach again.
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Dron_Gus
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by Dron_Gus »

https://ru.aliexpress.com/item/90pin-FCI-PCB/32952245197.html case + 90 pin connector.
Just received one - looks solid.
Or 90 pins is not enough?

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

Cinch enclosure found here. It includes the 60 pin harness connector, and a Molex 112 pin connector.
https://github.com/jharvey/Cinch_enclosure_template
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kneelo
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kneelo »

Not sure about enclosures but the connectors should be superseal 1.0 as used by motec, haltech and probably other aftermarket ECUs . They are compact, robust and easy to repin.

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

kneelo wrote:
Mon Dec 24, 2018 3:38 pm
Not sure about enclosures but the connectors should be superseal 1.0 as used by motec, haltech and probably other aftermarket ECUs . They are compact, robust and easy to repin.
Any specific URLs for exact part numbers? Are there pre-build pigtails available?
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by mck1117 »

russian wrote:
Mon Dec 24, 2018 5:59 pm
Are there pre-build pigtails available?
Not a big fan of splicing to a pigtail. Much nicer to crimp it yourself! My connectors are new connectors from Mouser, crimped with a $20 tool from Amazon. (plus it's faster and easier than splicing too!)

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by theflyingdutchp »

Is there a more modern case available in the JY with wide applications? Sort of like how the Denso case is pretty close across Mazda/Toyota/Subaru?

Otherwise - if you're concerned about adoption - following the dual-board approach seems to have some good advantages. IE: a small mainboard and then a daughterboard specific to the OE case/connector.

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by mck1117 »

https://www.te.com/usa-en/product-CAT-SU763-H342.html

These are the superseal. 26, 34, and 60 pin (which is just a 24+36) headers are available. 15 amps per pin. IP67 waterproof.

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

Pig tails are handy, such that you can sell a generic harness with like 15ft (5M) of cable. Then the installer cuts injector wires to length, and terminates only the injector side of the connector. It also avoids the need for an installer to have the crimp tool for this connector. The installer only needs the crimp tools for the other side of the harness.

I see the SUPERSEAL 1.0mm 60 pin costs like this.
$20.39 6437288-5 PCB connector includes pins
$6.30 4-1437290-0 34 pin Harness connector
$8.20 3-1437290-7 26 pin Harness connector
$14.40 = $0.24 * 60 of 3-1447221-3 Harness pins
$49.29 total or $0.83 per pin.

OEM crimp tool is 2305570-1 at $189

I recall that Mate-N-Lok was around $0.30 per pin, but is not as good of a connector. I also recall it's easy to get CPC's around $3 per pin. So this is a decent price for a quality connector. I would prefer an option for gold plated connectors for signal level connections. I have not found gold plated contacts for this connector yet.
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

I am really starting to like that 121 pin connector - it's weather-proof, it's available new and cheap, it's popular and used pigtails are plentiful at junk yards.

Unfortunately Bosch cases are pretty short - on the other hand these are thick, we can go vertical to some extent, but really short :(

Nissan cases are much bigger but these are low-profile. I probably need to get a nissan case next time I am in a junk yard.
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

How about mounting the ECU on an aluminium plate, then potting what ever shape we want. Basically make a silicon mold, assemble the board, place it in the silicon mold. Then pour in something like technomelt, and wait for it to cool down.

https://www.technomelt-simply3.com/en/pcb-markets.html
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by stefanst »

kb1gtt wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:49 am
How about mounting the ECU on an aluminium plate, then potting what ever shape we want. Basically make a silicon mold, assemble the board, place it in the silicon mold. Then pour in something like technomelt, and wait for it to cool down.

https://www.technomelt-simply3.com/en/pcb-markets.html
It seems my boards are constantly changing and evolving. Potting would be adding a lot of time for removal for each change....

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by Abricos »

kb1gtt wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 2:49 am
How about mounting the ECU on an aluminium plate, then potting what ever shape we want. Basically make a silicon mold, assemble the board, place it in the silicon mold. Then pour in something like technomelt, and wait for it to cool down.

https://www.technomelt-simply3.com/en/pcb-markets.html
its not cheap ...

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

Abricos wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:24 am
its not cheap ...
Do you know a source? I'm ignorant about the costs, and I have not found a supplier yet.
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

stefanst wrote:
Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:14 am
It seems my boards are constantly changing and evolving. Potting would be adding a lot of time for removal for each change....
I think developers are constantly making changes, while the PnP crowd doesn't want to make changes. Also this Technomelt is basically hot glue. You can remove it with heat. AKA toss it in a toaster oven, and melt if off. I'm not sure how well it's removed, but it can probably be done.

Also you could make a shell, instead of potting the entire board. Basically 3D print or make some kind of enclosure. Use that enclosure to make a soft mold. Then you can inject this stuff to make copies of that original. Below is a video showing how to do this with a 2 part epoxy used as a casting materiel. I think that 2 part epoxy is a bit pricey, and I think that technomelt is lower cost, but require heating.


Of course, making a 3D printed case is always an option. Have we checked the costs at https://www.shapeways.com/ or similar?
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by Abricos »

I did some tests ...
still need to do tests ...
check how solvent resistant ,gasoline,motor oil , temperature.......

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

I would like to make a small catalog of interesting OEM cases but what do I call them?

For instance this one - stamped aluminum 171x128mm cases is used by Bosch and Siemens, with 80 pin and 121 pin.

What do I call it? VAG_171_128 type based on popular usage and size?
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by puff »

what about height?
may be by vehicles? (easier to find the right junkyard)
speaking about those stamped designs - what's the way they fix the board to the enclosure? just with a connector? or they have studs attached to the boards?

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by andreika »

ME7.8.8 enclosure for 81-pin connector:
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Available new at aliexpress:
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Electronic-Control-Unit-Accessories-ECU-cover-car-engine-computer-shell-ME7-8-8-ECU-140-80/32810392033.html

"Electronic Control Unit Accessories/ECU cover/car engine computer shell/ME7.8.8 ECU 140*80*27MM No connector included" $20

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by pobedyst »

For my project, I have already decided on the type of case. The choice was obvious after a trip to disassemble cars. I took the ECU Siemens MS41.0. It cost me UAH 500, which is about $ 17. They are simply not needed by anyone in my city, their mountains. In addition, I have a native connector (Siemens / Bosch). Considering the concept of hull search for RusEfi, I would study the issue for manufacturing a matrix for casting ABS plastic with the top cover of an ECU, and close the lower part with a simple aluminum sheet. Either contacting the Chinese and ordering a batch, which, under the conditions of the international series, will not be very budget, but no one bothers to ask a question to several manufacturers. If none of you worked with the Chinese, then I think I can turn to my friends who are supplying spare parts for the Korean car market, they worked with the Chinese and at least give directions to whom to look for or what to look for, of course, if necessary. Just let me know if my option is interesting.
As for individual projects, it is best to use OEM wiring, which already has connectors. Missing wires can be independently diluted.

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

YUEQING HAIDIE ELECTRIC CO.,LTD is a Chinese manufacturer of connectors, they seem to produce their version of many popular connectors. They also produce a few enclosures integrated with connectors - for instance 48p plastic case https://yqwakan.com/product_4882_48pECUAluminumEnclosureBoxwithCaseMotorCarLPGCNGConversionKitsControllerAutoConnector.html and 39p https://yqwakan.com/product_4881_FCI39PinsECUwithAluminumboxAutoConnectorVehicleControllerMountingPCBCarAutomotiveconnector.html

48p option costs under $20 for box + male + female connectors

Attached are the datasheets they have shared over email. Is this too large or is this perfect for rusEfiMini motorcycle option?

48p box-2 uses HD481-1.5-21
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by kb1gtt »

Oh la la. You should warn about not safe for work content :) I got excited and started humping my desk.

Do they offer a 3D model?
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by AndreyB »

Found my dream case! The search for a case is over :)

BS01 by Wenzhou Boshun Electronics Co., Ltd.
comes with 8-1393476-0 80 pin connector https://rusefi.com/wiki/index.php?title=Hardware:OEM_connectors#80_pin + harness connectors + terminals.
8-1393476-0 plastic shape is compatible with 121 pin connector.

Under $30.

HUGE case. See comparison where it's taller than 121 Nissan case and wider than 154 pin direct injected VW case. See picture where discovery boards fits under Frankenso board and both fit inside the case easy.

For smaller cases see https://rusefi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1538
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westfieldmx5
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Re: let's choose an enclosure

Post by westfieldmx5 »

That case looks interesting. Do they sell 1 single unit or do you need to buy in bulk? They are on Alibaba but seems that I cannot buy there.
One thought though, how is the connector quality with these Chinese units? I'm looking into the modICE case as well. A case with 48 pins, complete with all connectors is about $80 from Mouser. More expensive but from a reputable seller and waterproof.
Last edited by westfieldmx5 on Thu Nov 21, 2019 6:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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