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GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:36 pm
by AndreyB
Direct Injection is giving us a completely new domain - now we need to control fuel pressure. There is the strategy of deciding on target fuel pressure based on load, RPM etc and there is the tactics of actually achieving that desired fuel pressure.

A relevant picture from Slack, this fuel entry solenoid is also peak and hold.

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 10:12 pm
by puff
where is the fuel pressure sensor?
i'd love to see the circuitry for that one.

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Tue Feb 04, 2020 10:18 pm
by mck1117
puff wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 10:12 pm
where is the fuel pressure sensor?
i'd love to see the circuitry for that one.
The fuel pressure sensor is on the fuel rail. They're not particularly exciting, actually: just normal linear analog pressure sensors with two outputs.

Here's a Ford Fiesta ST as an example:

Image

1. fuel pump
2. fuel injector connectors (injectors aimed straight down in to head)
3. fuel pressure sensor

edit: here's the video that's snipped from, showing disassembly of the DI system on that car:

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 12:04 am
by puff
and what's the nominal pressure? by any chance, do you have part numbers/pictures of those pressure sensor and solenoid valve?

I still have a similar challenge - build a cheap diy version of FrankenCIS, which has essentially the same concept: control fuel pressure (withstanding up to 150psi) based on coolant temperature, load and RPM using a certain type of fuel injector instead of a solenoid valve.
In FrankenCIS they suggest using megasquirt to control it - still not sure if it was P&H or the normal one.

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Wed Feb 05, 2020 1:15 am
by mck1117
Here are the tables that define the fuel flow/pressure controls on my 2013 Ford Focus ST.

Image

Observations:

- Injector flow is proportional to the square root of the pressure (within about 2%, this is true of all injectors). Roughly g/s = 0.142 * sqrt(kpa) for these injectors.
- Injection pressure is higher under higher loads and speeds (duh): around 250psi at idle, and 2000 PSI under load at speed

These two effects combine to give a pulse width that's relatively constant: it's always in the 1-5ms range, because for direct injection you have to. You only have limited time to inject fuel, so you have to get it done in a hurry, but waste a minimum of extra power driving the pump harder (higher pressure).

Another observation is that it always runs at high pressure (~2000psi) for about 30 seconds after engine start, at which point it switches to the table. You can audibly hear this happen outside the car, because the pump gets silent for around 1 second while the fuel pressure drops (being emptied out the injectors - the pump can only increase pressure in the rail).

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:30 pm
by AndreyB

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Sat Feb 29, 2020 8:43 pm
by AndreyB
@abricos made a step forward - OEM box from BMW 760 is in charge of high voltage injectors for now. This gives us a baseline and a way to test the fuel rig before we migrate to rusEfi own high voltage injection control.


Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:08 pm
by Abricos
Flow test ... 20bar pressure ...
* delay 100, cylinder #3, 5ms ON, 1000ms OFF, repeat 2 times
* fuelbench2 100 3 5 1000 2


Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:43 pm
by dammogreen
Hello , I've been lurking and just registered.

Maybe I missed it but I am not sure if anyone has mentioned that the solenoid that controls fuel pressure on GDI pumps is *timed* to the driving lobes, By ecu control. It's not just a simple untimed pwm pid drive loop.

It was not something I had envisioned when looking into GDI injector and pump control, but makes sense.

Just trying to save people some dev time. read below: https://www.pi-innovo.com/gdi-fuel-pump-control/

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:12 am
by kb1gtt
Yeah the pumps can be a pain. I understand that you can typically over drive the pump which simplifies it but at the cost of shorter pump life and lost hp. For now there is a flow bench that uses a brake pump to generate pressure. The proto PCB had been getting broken on the east coast then repaired on the west coast. The pcbs have been getting shipped back and forth. We are making progress. Little by little we are chipping away at it. Thanks for the discussion.

Do you have a test bench or interest in gdi?

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:54 am
by dammogreen
Sorry no test bench yet, eventually I may build a GDI driver box to be driven by a stand alone ecu. Whenever I get to that I will share any information.

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:39 am
by AndreyB
dammogreen wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:54 am
eventually I may build a GDI driver box to be driven by a stand alone ecu.
Have you seen our progress on https://rusefi.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=1337? We have some relevant hardware and even a bit of software. Where are you located? Maybe a "hello world" thread? :)

Re: GDI - High Pressure Fuel Pump Control

Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:07 am
by mck1117
dammogreen wrote:
Sun Jun 07, 2020 9:43 pm
Maybe I missed it but I am not sure if anyone has mentioned that the solenoid that controls fuel pressure on GDI pumps is *timed* to the driving lobes, By ecu control. It's not just a simple untimed pwm pid drive loop.
There are actually both types. Most GDI are what you describe, where you control the closing of the inlet valve to the pump to decide how much volume gets forced in per cycle. Some diesel pumps are actually continuous (asynchronous) PWM controlled.