Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

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ELMEPRO
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Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

Hello, i think it will be cool to make it work because Volvo steering pump is very popular on drift cars, but it will run only 70% power without CAN bus speed input.

Does rusefi has support for it to control trough CAN bus pump speed?

I know that maxxecu has done it:
https://www.maxxecu.com/webhelp/can_peripheral_control_volvo_powersteering.html

EDIT by AndreyB, TL,DR:
yes we do now https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/blob/master/firmware/controllers/lua/examples/Volvo-electric-power-steering-pump.txt
rusEFI hardware starts at $300 at https://www.shop.rusefi.com/shop/p/microrusefi-assembled-ecu-development-module
Last edited by ELMEPRO on Sat May 14, 2022 6:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN buss control

Post by mck1117 »

I have one of those pumps on my endurance race car. I run it in the mode without CAN and it works totally fine. Almost undetectable that it's not the mechanical pump on the engine feeding the rack.

I'd also be interested in making it talk over CAN, but to be honest I'm not sure of the value. It works fine as-is in the "failsafe" mode.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN buss control

Post by AndreyB »

We have Lua script to send any messages. do we know what messages need to be send when?

I am available to add useful callbacks into Lua if anything is missing to have this working via Lua
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN buss control

Post by mck1117 »

AndreyB wrote:
Thu May 12, 2022 8:19 pm
do we know what messages need to be send when?
we do not, I would have done this by now if we did
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

Tnx, i also found some recordings on forums sems like its popular to play with can bus, im new in can bus sou it will be a wonderful experience :D

Tomorrow plan is to send whole recordings to pump maybe it will work on 100% and soft start if yes, then my plan is delete some of can bus messages to get only ones what pump wants.

Also its starts on 100% then its really drop the speed! I tried to drive on 100% 2seconds it was like day and night, if i will not success last plan is to get volvo from my friends car sales shop and record can buss.

Bay da way car is e46 m50b25 turbo, later i will show my project!
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

Seems like lua script is to hard for me can someone help to code example to send message to can buss?

0x0617ff8 81 3b 01 00 01 00 a0 00 command will wake up low speed can modules for a while
0x12177FC 01 02 40 00 10 40 3A B8 //speed: B6 b0-b1 – B7 b0-b7, divide by 4, 174km/h
0x2A07428 0B 0D C4 0E 0F FD 2F 17 //revs: B6 b0-b3 - B7 b0-b7, 3863 per minute
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by JRD McLAREN »

OT:
some dialogues for other steering pumps is welcome ..

I have pump from Mercedes A klasse - it need 12V signal ..
and another TRW pump form any OPEL .. for testing ..
.. some Proteus and microRusEFI for sale in Europe ..
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

Here's what I recieve from my Volvo pump:

Code: Select all

2022-05-18_00_58_39_790: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 04 51
2022-05-18_00_58_39_878: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71
2022-05-18_00_58_39_990: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71
2022-05-18_00_58_39_990: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71

<repeats>

2022-05-18_00_58_44_054: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71
2022-05-18_00_58_44_156: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71
2022-05-18_00_58_44_156: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71
2022-05-18_00_58_44_262: EngineState: CAN_rx bus=0 1B200002(455081986) 8: 00 00 00 00 00 00 0F 71

<pump stops sending but keeps running>
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

The log in this post contains the same ID, 1b200002: https://www.diyelectriccar.com/threads/volvo-electro-hydraulic-power-steering.44828/page-5#post-1046821

That log shows similar behavior: One frame of 0451, repeated frames of 0f71, BUT THEN a transition to 0f73, which presumably means the pump was turned on by the ECU. That transition happens ~3 seconds after the first 0f71 frame is seen.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

Sou there is a way to trick pump, on that same forum and thread, 0e410003 - can bus alive will start up with no delay, and 2e414003 seems like affects pump speed by editing second byte (in index 1), but after 5 seconds pump enter fail safe but it will keep last speed what we sent to can in failsafe, sou if we can a least trick it to work on 100% in failsafe it would be ideal, because i actually giving up already ordered ESC and my plan is to rewind motor to 3 phase and use with pwm :?
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

ELMEPRO wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 8:49 am
Sou there is a way to trick pump, on that same forum and thread, 0e410003 - can bus alive will start up with no delay, and 2e414003 seems like affects pump speed by editing second byte (in index 1), but after 5 seconds pump enter fail safe but it will keep last speed what we sent to can in failsafe, sou if we can a least trick it to work on 100% in failsafe it would be ideal, because i actually giving up already ordered ESC and my plan is to rewind motor to 3 phase and use with pwm :?
I don't see either of those IDs in the log from that other guy's C30 that I posted, but I do see the message my pump sends. I guess I could try a replay attack on the pump to see if it responds, then whittle down to which messages actually do something.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

ELMEPRO wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 8:49 am
rewind motor to 3 phase and use with pwm
I don't think that will work - I think it's actually a switched reluctance motor, so it has an incompatible number of poles/phases if you wanted to rewind it in to a BLDC.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

ELMEPRO wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 8:49 am
Sou there is a way to trick pump, on that same forum and thread, 0e410003 - can bus alive will start up with no delay, and 2e414003 seems like affects pump speed by editing second byte (in index 1), but after 5 seconds pump enter fail safe but it will keep last speed what we sent to can in failsafe, sou if we can a least trick it to work on 100% in failsafe it would be ideal, because i actually giving up already ordered ESC and my plan is to rewind motor to 3 phase and use with pwm :?
Ok it looks like he got the endianness backwards on those IDs - they're actually 0x0300410E and 0x0340412E. I do indeed get some response from the pump for a few seconds when I send those parts of the log.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

maxxecu sends IDs 2104136 and 1ae0092c to the pump

2104136 is ~71.4hz
1ae0092c is ~2.38hz

exact 30:1 ratio

pump responds at 11.84hz, which is 1/6 the rate of 2104136
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

image.png
image.png (205.51 KiB) Viewed 25137 times
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by mck1117 »

Here's the Lua that was running for that video:



It just waits until it sees the "I'm alive!" message from the pump, then starts sending.

The 1ae0092c frame seems to just keep the pump alive and listening/sending over CAN, and it's sent at 1/30 the rate of the other message.

The 2104136 frame sends something that's probably vehicle speed based on the logs from other people above. Most of the bits are (or can be) static, last two bytes are 16-bit big endian unsigned speed. Small values make the pump run fast, large values slow it down.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

No way :o

You did it, this is big feature i think it should be added to rusefi as a extra!
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

Who would be the first one to combine it with BMW keypad? Not that hou really need to adjust it on track

So who would be to have it variable by GPS? :)
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

mck1117 wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 11:42 pm
Here's the Lua that was running for that video:



It just waits until it sees the "I'm alive!" message from the pump, then starts sending.

The 1ae0092c frame seems to just keep the pump alive and listening/sending over CAN, and it's sent at 1/30 the rate of the other message.

The 2104136 frame sends something that's probably vehicle speed based on the logs from other people above. Most of the bits are (or can be) static, last two bytes are 16-bit big endian unsigned speed. Small values make the pump run fast, large values slow it down.
Sou i wired up and cant get it to work tried can1 can2, lua script tell me that id 1b200002 not callable, do i need change something in MS can bus communication tab?
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

ELMEPRO wrote:
Fri May 27, 2022 2:27 pm
lua script tell me that id 1b200002 not callable, do i need change something in MS can bus communication tab?
you do not paste screen shot of error
you vaguely describe what you did
MS?!?!
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

My apologies!

Error :
2022-05-27_17_38_23_239: EngineState: confirmation_luareset:8
2022-05-27_17_38_23_373: EngineState: LUA loading script length: 1055...
2022-05-27_17_38_23_373: EngineState: LUA ERROR loading script: [string "-- "alive" message from pump..."]:2: global 'canRxAdd' is not callable (a nil value)
2022-05-27_17_38_23_373: EngineState: LUA: Tearing down instance...

Settings in tuner studio:
Image

I can confirm that i receive can bus id 1b200002 from pump on arduino can bus sniffer
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

Still looking forward the MS clarification!

More info is needed on how exactly you copy-paste Lua code, something seems pretty broken in that area.
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

Fixed, working like a charm problem was in proteus f4 20220422 firmware
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

ELMEPRO wrote:
Sat May 28, 2022 2:52 pm
problem was in proteus f4 20220422 firmware
Please elaborate. At the moment you take the risky path of baselessly blaming software
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by ELMEPRO »

Im not blaming anyone please be understandable only thing what i did was updaiting firmware didnt touch any wires
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

mck1117 wrote:
Thu May 26, 2022 11:42 pm
Here's the Lua that was running for that video:
copy-pasted into https://github.com/rusefi/rusefi/tree/master/firmware/controllers/lua/examples
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by AndreyB »

image.png
image.png (299.11 KiB) Viewed 23031 times
Volvo Electric Power Steering Pump P1 platform ranging from 2004-2013

30636927 31202520 36000075 36000116 36000772 36000801 36001211 36001485 36002698 36050678 8603041 8603274

Interesting note on https://www.maxxecu.com/webhelp/can_peripheral_control_volvo_powersteering.html
If using a PDM for all other electronics, please route the power steering outside the PDM system to use a separate fuse and relay for any kind of power steering (the flyback generated from a power steering can kill the most powerful flyback protection).
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Re: Volvo electric power steering pump CAN bus control

Post by nmstec »

Well yeah... 80 amps... Why would you ever want to use it with a PDM...
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